The Bible Compares Us to Clay – This Artist Lives It

Show Notes

I’m back with an inspiring chat with ceramic artist Morgan McCarver. She shares her journey into pottery after back surgery ended her dance career. Through sculpting clay, Morgan deepened her connection with God. The Bible compares us to clay and God the potter – molding and shaping us. Morgan found healing by leaning into her creative talents. She advises finding your creative outlet to grow closer to God. We all express creativity differently – even in spreadsheets or organization! God speaks through our unique passions. Morgan also runs her own pottery business, selling online and at festivals. She is transparent about the challenges but keeps going because of her purpose. Balancing a day job allows her to pace herself physically while still pursuing her dream. Finally, hear the story behind Morgan’s new book God the Artist. After failure years ago, she surrendered her writing plans to God. His perfect timing brought the book together – and a publisher! Let Morgan’s journey inspire you to embrace your creativity, follow your purpose, and trust God’s plans. What stuck out to you most? Let me know in the comments!

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Morgan’s Links:

Website:www.morganmccarver.com
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/morgan_mccarver_porcelain/
Book: https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/god-the-artist-morgan-mccarver/1143408943
Shop: https://www.etsy.com/shop/MorganMPorcelain

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TIMESTAMPS:


00:00:00 – Introduction to Consultation Services

00:01:16 – Discovering Pottery

00:04:01 – Faith and Trials

00:11:45 – Biblical Themes in Pottery

00:14:00 – Symbolism in Pottery

00:14:32 – The Humility of Being God’s Creation

00:15:05 – The Fragility and Beauty of Mankind

00:16:17 – Navigating a Pottery Business

00:21:00 – Motivation and Adaptability in Business

00:25:06 – Writing “God the Artist”

00:28:48 – Embracing Creativity as a Reflection of God

00:29:53 – Overcoming Self-Doubt and Embracing Creativity

00:30:26 – Broad Definition of Creativity

00:31:32 – Connecting with God Through Creativity

00:32:41 – Connecting with Morgan and Her Work

TRANSCRIPT: 

00:00:09 – Johnny Sanders
I am now offering consultation services through faithfully engaged. If you’re struggling to find a church, dealing with a destructive habit such as pornography, or trying to find a way to homeschool your kids but don’t know where to start, come check me out. Go to faithfullyengaged.com consulting to learn more information and to see how we can get started. Well, welcome back, everyone, to another episode of Faithfully Engaged today. I’m really excited to have Morgan McCarver on here today. If you’ve listened to some of my past episodes, you’ll know that I really enjoy having artists and authors on the show, in part because I just really appreciate the way that God makes us all a little bit different. And I really appreciate artistic people in the sense that my brain doesn’t work that way. I certainly am not a ceramic artist like Morgan is here today. But Morgan, it’s great to have you on, and why don’t you just tell the audience just a little bit about yourself?

00:01:12 – Morgan McCarver
Hi, thank you so much for having me and great introduction. Like you said, my name is Morgan McCarver. I’m a Carolina girl. I grew up in South Carolina, and I live in Asheville, North Carolina now. You’re right, I am a pottery. I’m also now an author, so I can add that to my list. And I love living in the mountains. I love being in nature and all that good stuff.

00:01:34 – Johnny Sanders
Fantastic. Well, let’s start with just pottery in general. I think most people have either done some basic pottery. I’ve known somebody maybe, and had high school or something, did like one project or something. But I don’t know if too many people have gotten into it with career aspirations or just serious interest. So tell us just a little bit about your journey of getting into pottery in the first place.

00:02:02 – Morgan McCarver
Of course. Well, it wasn’t a family business or anything. That’s usually the first question that I get, like, I must have, you know, been trained by my parents. But no, my parents are creative in their own ways. But pottery really did not come into my life until I was a teenager. And it really was because I needed a creative outlet. So before I had back surgery, I was a dancer, and then I had scoliosis, and spinal fusion surgery, and I was really missing a creative outlet in my life. And ultimately, that’s what led to me discovering a love for ceramics. During that summer, my mom signed me up for a pottery class. And so that was my first academic introduction to ceramics, so to speak. And from there, I just kept taking more classes. And eventually, I did go to Sanders, to get a degree for that.

00:02:53 – Johnny Sanders
Great. I really like the way you put this, of that creative outlet. And this is something I mentioned there in the beginning of just the introduction here, that God has made us all different. And while my personal artistic talents some of just like drawing or whatever aren’t all that great, I do have creative pieces of me. I’ve talked often on the podcast that even just my creation of this podcast is kind of an extension of that creativity. So we are, it’s not an optional thing. If we are created in God’s image, he is the creator of all life. Like we have to have creative outlets. And me saying all this with you getting, you were dancing and all of these back issues, I’m sure that was incredibly disheartening, especially at your age. What role, or maybe even a better question is, did faith play at all in this realm from going from dancing to doing pottery?

00:04:01 – Morgan McCarver
Great question. And I completely agree with you that everyone is creative, and I do kind of go into that. You pretty much were just quoting the first three chapters of my book. But to answer your question, about faith, I was a Christian. I was raised in a Christian home, and I became a Christian at about seven or eight years old. So by the time I had scoliosis surgery, I was 14 when I had the surgery. So I had been a Christian for a while, but faith did come into it for sure. You know, when you’re a kid and you’re that young. Basically, my faith was what my parents made it to be. They drove me to church. They drove me to kids’ choir. I was happy to go. I had no complaints, but I didn’t really know that I had a choice, necessarily, if that makes sense. And so my faith was just what was expected of me. And then when I learned that I was going to have to have this surgery, I knew for about a year. And so I really was praying for that miraculous healing that you read about in the Bible, and that still does happen today. I’ve talked to people who were in my same experience, and God miraculously healed their spines and they never had to have the surgery. And so I was praying for that experience for myself. And that wasn’t, obviously that wasn’t the case. That wasn’t the story that God gave me. And at the time I was so mad and I didn’t know why, and I was so afraid. And my relationship with God after the surgery really was just still more of what was expected of me. I had strengthened my prayer life through going through the surgery, of course, but my faith really kind of skyrocketed, and I was able to grow closer to God through just honestly through the connection of pottery because there are so many Bible verses about God being the potter and where being the clay, and we are vessels. All of these references that really, me honing my techniques in a passion that God gave me, allowed me to connect with him over time. And then looking back on my surgery experience over a decade later, I’m able to see now all the beauty that was in that story and that God gave me that testimony so that I could have the story I do now and I couldn’t share my message. And it is a much better story of redemption that God revealed in my life that wouldn’t have happened if I hadn’t had scoliosis and had, you know, danced my whole life or whatever. Who knows where I’d be living now, what my job would be, or any of that. So really, God transformed my life through that surgery.

00:06:31 – Johnny Sanders
It’s always incredible to see the. The finished product. I say that. I mean, you’re by no means a finished product, as none of us are. But to look back a decade later at this surgery and thinking, yeah, when you’re 14, that you’re a teenager, my life is over, basically. You know, things are. Things are bad, um, when you’re going through that. And that is a that’s a very catastrophic thing for a teenage girl to, to hear, uh, but to look back on that with just seeing all the ways that God has used that, um, has been able to. To work it for his good, um, and to, to work it for your good as well, it’s just so beautiful to be able to sit back and look at that. But going back to when you’re, you’re a teenager, can. You didn’t. You didn’t always feel that in those moments, you had those rocky moments. So for people that might be listening maybe they’re not going through something physical, maybe it’s mental or something that’s relationally challenging some type of trial in their life. What’s kind of your go-to after you go through such a big issue, or big trial in your life, what’s kind of your go-to advice for people who are dealing with these big trials? What kind of advice can you give them to be able to make it through those trials?

00:07:53 – Morgan McCarver
Yeah, that’s a great point. Everyone struggles with something. Obviously, we’re human. We live in a fallen world. There’s going to be something we struggle with. And it looks different for everybody. Sometimes it’s physical, and sometimes it’s mental sometimes it’s both. For me, I didn’t fully understand the mental challenges that were going to come out of my scoliosis experience. I knew it was going to be a year-long recovery process. I knew I wasn’t going to be able to dance for that year. I knew I was losing my friend group because I couldn’t go to dance, but I didn’t know how that was going to affect me mentally. And so for the listeners who are struggling in that way or in any similar way, any kind of struggle, I would say just, it’s not going to be immediate. And that’s what is so hard because I’m a very impatient person. I get it. I want to know immediately, why is this happening? What’s the purpose? What is my purpose? And that was my prayer for years, for pretty much over a decade. Just, lord, what is my purpose? Why are you giving me this love for pottery? Why are these things happening to me? Why are these things, other things not happening to me? And honestly, just seeking after God’s purpose, can feel frustrating when you don’t get a clear answer. And so I would say just keep pursuing that. Keep on the daily grind, whatever that looks like for you. Memorizing scripture really does help just flooding your mind with the truth, because there are so many lies when you’re going through a situation like that, that the devil’s just constantly throwing at you. All of these lies of, you know, your identity, your worth, all of that’s taken away, and it feels like it is. But we have to remember that our identity is in Christ. And so all of these things, all of these lies can really send us, me included, into a dark place. And so that’s where having that scripture to rely on, having a strong Christian community to fall back on and really admit, you know, I’m struggling, please pray for me in this situation. Those are really powerful relationships that can do amazing things.

00:10:04 – Johnny Sanders
I think that is some. Some wonderful advice, especially from somebody who has lived that. And I really appreciate you sharing that. Yeah, we all do have these different struggles. They just don’t always look the same. But a couple of key points in that is, yeah, finding the truth. You’re gonna find that in scripture. You. You need to earnestly seek that because of the lies you’re mentioning. Through the evil one, through just the different things that come through our life in this fallen world, the lies will seek you, whether it’s you’re not good enough or your life is over or God’s out to get you. He’s just punishing you. I mean, all sorts of lies can seep in, so we need to base those lies on truth. And scripture is going to really help magnify that truth, be able to look at the things you’re going through and be able to put that through the prism of scripture to see what is truth and what are lies. And I also love that you follow that up with being surrounded around a good community, whether that’s people in your church, family members, or friends, but again, especially your church, like your church is supposed to be there to do life with you. So don’t shy away from those struggles. Be open about that because they’re there to help you kind of go on that theme of scripture. This is something you mentioned earlier that I find fascinating, specifically with kind of your career choice of pottery. Through your studies of scripture, and especially as you have gotten into pottery and been able to look at scripture through that lens. What are some of these themes that you see in scripture, specifically about pottery?

00:11:51 – Morgan McCarver
Ooh, that’s fun. That’s a fun topic that I love to talk about. It stems from us being compared to clay and God being compared to a potter. And in my own practice, when I go into the studio as the potter, I know exactly what I’m going to do for the day. I go in with confidence and with a plan, and I am using the clay for my benefit to make my business what it is. And now I’m able to parallel that relationship with me being the clay. I have to realize God comes into my life with that confidence, with the plan, knowing how he’s going to use me for his purpose. And that’s just something that is really, really powerful when I’m able to kind of see both sides of it. But even moving on further than that, if you think about clay itself, it is literally, it can be dug straight out of the ground. They call that wild clay. And you can process clay, especially here in the Carolinas, that red mud. You can process that clay and actually fire it. And so if you think about it, like, we are also compared to the dust of the earth, which goes back to Genesis, right? And how God created Adam from the dust of the earth. But it also refers to us. Some of the verses talk about as vessels. We’re earthen vessels, and it sounds so beautiful that we’re pottery vessels, but we also are very fragile. We’re very fragile human beings. You know, if our temperature varies by just a couple of degrees, we’re sick. You know, it’s a very fragile body that we’re in. And likewise, our minds are so prone to temptation and so prone to spiraling and all of these things that you think, oh, it’s beautiful. We’re pottery vessels, and it is, but we are also very, very fragile in the scheme of things and so constantly relying on God to protect us and to sustain us. And then on top of that, vessels are empty and they hold things. So we need to treat our bodies in the same way. We’re holding the Holy Spirit, we’re holding the word of God in our hearts. So all of these different comparisons can come in. And it’s just so beautiful when I’m in the studio and God’s giving me these little snippets of wisdom and constantly referencing back to what I’m doing in the studio, there’s usually some moment throughout that day that God’s showing me, like, this is the same with your life. Don’t miss the symbolism.

00:14:27 – Johnny Sanders
I love that, especially because this is something you’re so, you’re so passionate about. And I mean, you’re exactly right there. There is a lot of reference to pottery in that way in scripture. And I like that what you’re teasing out here from the scriptures that God made us, we came from the dirt, and that that alone should be some sense of, of humility there that, you know, sometimes we elevate our own lives, we elevate our own struggles that essentially we don’t need God. We’re above God and we’re not. But I love that. Yeah, we’re fragile. We need God. We’re molded by him. But there is a sense of beauty. There’s a sense of beauty in mankind, not because of our own doing. Yeah, we’re, we’re that red clay just out of, out of the dirt, but because of the way that he has molded us, that the person we’re made in his image from. I think that’s something that’s interesting about Christians. When we have a very biblical worldview, we can have a more negative view towards man than the world in the sense that we are sinful and we need to have that view that we’re, we’re not gods. Sometimes the world kind of views man as God, but we also tend to have a higher view of man than the world has as well. We see this with just some of the ways that the world treats their fellow neighbor, treats their fellow man. And it can be quite disgusting and awful. And even the way that we treat ourselves, we have that worth. And Christians need to realize, you have that worth. Your neighbors have that worth, not because of what we’ve done, but because of the potter, because of. Because of God, who. Who molded us. So I think that it’s just wonderful in your personal life that you can see that through your scripture reading. Kind of switching gears here a little bit. A lot of what I like to get into on the podcast is to help listeners realize that, yeah, there’s. There’s some tough stuff going on in the world, and it’s okay to recognize that. But there are some practical steps that we can take. There’s. There are some practical things we can do to make our lives better and more active and engaged in life. And another thing that kind of attracted me to you with your. Your story is just one, being a. Being a business owner and also being an author. I’m kind of just starting on the business owner side, and I have some experience, in this as well. I know many people, like, my job is terrible. I want to start my own business, but I don’t know how to do it. It’s too scary. So just kind of share your experience of being a small business owner. Some of the challenges with that, and maybe some of the benefits of going out and making your own business, of course.

00:17:25 – Morgan McCarver
So my business started in 2019, basically when I graduated college. And it is a lot of navigating the world, right? Trying to figure out the best way to sell pottery and how to market myself. So that does come into play. And then the pandemic hit, of course, which messed up everyone’s numbers across the board. So now we’re really in that phase after COVID, trying to figure out what does business look like again? How do you market yourself in a different way? Everything’s gone online, so much so for my own self, I try to have a bunch of different things going. So I’ve got an etsy shop and a fair wholesale shop where people can buy online. But pottery is hard to sell online because it is such a hands on relationship. Honestly, if you’re using a mug, you’re holding that with your hand. The handle needs to fit appropriately to your hand. It needs to be comfortable to drink out of. You’re putting your lips on the rim of that piece. It’s a very personal relationship to buy pottery. And so because of that, pottery sells best in person, which does prove a challenge because I can’t be everywhere all at once. So because of that, I have been able to get into different galleries and shops between the Carolinas and Tennessee. And I’m in about nine or ten. And that way my pottery is available constantly in multiple different areas. And sometimes that means I am renting a booth and I pay a monthly fee and sell my pottery through that store. Sometimes that means that my work is there for free, but they take a commission every time something sells. So there are different ways that pottery or art businesses kind of run their shops like that. Consignment is great, wholesale is another great way to do that. And then I also do festivals. And so show season typically is in the fall to winter because pottery sells really well as Christmas gifts. And so people love to buy mugs and give them to their family members or whatever they might be buying. So usually the Saturdays in the fall are completely devoted to pottery shows. And that involves me, you know, putting in 1012 hours, days, maybe longer if it’s a longer drive to load up my car, drive to the site, set up for the day, have some sales, then tear down, put it all back in my car and drive it back to the studio and unload. So it’s a lot to do for one person, of course, and it’s not easy, but it’s just constantly keeping me on my toes, constantly making sure that my business is well-rounded enough that I feel like I’m not missing out on any opportunities.

00:20:14 – Johnny Sanders
I think you hit something important there at the end of well-rounded enough. You can’t just say, well, Amazon’s doing so well. So let me just put all my stuff online. For some businesses maybe, but for years, no. So I’ve got to find these different areas and be able to make it more sustainable in that way. What it has been like during these challenges, especially after COVID, which, yeah, nobody could have predicted and nobody had a guide map how to, how to work through that. What was your motivation level and what kept you to continue going to stay well-rounded after the pandemic despite these challenges?

00:20:57 – Morgan McCarver
Great question. Honestly, it’s kind of a couple of things. For one, pottery is my passion and so it’s something that I enjoy so much that I’m always in the studio, I’m constantly making products. And so part of that is I’ve got a lot of back stock and I need to move it. Right. To make more pottery and to buy more supplies. To make more pottery, I need to sell the pottery I’ve already made and make some money off of that. So that was a big motivation. Another thing though was during the pandemic, I actually, was working retail at the time. I was working at a ceramic supply store and I did not enjoy retail during COVID anymore. I’m guessing most people who worked in retail didn’t, but it was really hard. The lead times for products were over a year out. Customers, of course, were frustrated, and I understand that. And I wanted to focus more on my pottery instead of focusing on the supply chain. And so essentially, that’s what brought me to Asheville. I moved up here to work for a potter. So I got to see how she ran her studio, and her business, what running a pottery business looks like, how to market yourself, and how to set up a booth appropriately where the pieces are easily seen and easily approachable. And so all of those things kind of played into what my business is now, so to speak. But I will say during that time, I also learned that physically, with my back, I can’t put in full days in the pottery studio. I did it for a year and a half working for her and working for myself at the same time. And I learned physically, my body cannot hold out that long. So I honestly decided to find a desk job so that I could have that supplemental income while I am continuing my pottery business. So most of the day, I am sitting, catching my breath, conserving my energy for then in the evenings to go and put in a very physical day in the studio. So it’s a nice balance for me, and that’s what works for me. And I think that that’s important to remember that you don’t have to be full-time to qualify as a small business. There’s a lot of different things that go into that. And so just encouraging the listeners to take that step, put as much time into your small business as you can, but don’t feel like it needs to control you. And don’t feel like if you have more than one job, then you’re not successful. Because, you know, what is success? If you’re comparing success to how the world compares success, you’re going to be disappointed. So we have to look at how God views us, and that’s where our value lies.

00:23:31 – Johnny Sanders
I think that was a great response there. Yeah. Some practical steps yet. It doesn’t have to be your full-time job. You don’t have to sell everything and bet on this one business, you can build it up step by step. I know that I kind of did that with my. With my counseling practice. I was working a different job and slowly let that build up on its own. There are a lot of different ways to make it happen, but, yeah, what is God’s purpose for my life? Had a recent episode where we talked about that, finding purpose in life. And if you don’t have a purpose, you don’t have a purpose for your life as a whole. You don’t have a purpose for your small business. You’re not going to get very far with it.

00:24:13 – Morgan McCarver
But.

00:24:13 – Johnny Sanders
But you’ve been able to find that purpose and been able to be adaptable. Um, I can go full-time. I can do part-time. We’ll make it work if you have that purpose if it’s just doing it to do it, um, you’ll flame out eventually. So I like that advice there. And that leads into. And I’ve had several people on here recently that have started their writing journey, book writing journey. I would love to hear your perspective on one. Just what led you to make your book in the first place, and what was that process like for you?

00:24:49 – Morgan McCarver
Of course, it really started when I was about to graduate college because Sanders University in South Carolina is a Christian school. It’s the South Carolina School of the Arts. So it was one of the few places I could still get a degree in ceramics because that’s kind of fizzling out, but that’s a different story. But basically, I had had these mentors and professors who were constantly pointing us back to Jesus, pointing us back to our faith in our work, and I was about to lose that community. So I was looking for a devotion book that I could read as an artist and specifically a Potter, going through these Bible verses that I had been picking up on, and there wasn’t really a book that I could find for what I was looking for. So at that point, the Holy Spirit just kind of put it on my heart that this could be something I could work on. So in 2019, I started writing a very rough draft, and I tried to get it published then, and it was a different publisher, and they said that basically I’d have to pay a lot of money to get it published, and I’d pretty much have to have someone rewrite it for me. And so at that point, it just wasn’t a good fit for me. I was fresh out of college. I didn’t have a bunch of money to just throw at a potential project. Who knows what would have happened? And so I felt like the Holy Spirit was telling me to just put it on hold until I got more experience. And I thought that was going to be decades down the line. I thought I’d be retired, writing like, a memoir or something, but it really was just a couple of years. And so in January of 2023, I felt the holy spirit telling me to revisit that manuscript. And that’s when I basically rewrote it. And during that time, those few short years, yes, of course, COVID happened, but I had been working for the ceramic supply retailer. I worked for the Potter full-time. I moved states. I was learning all of these different things. I had joined a community studio and had my own space in there, learning from other artists in the same space. So I had gained all this experience that I didn’t even know. Even teaching classes teaches you so much about pottery. And so all of these things kind of culminated into January of 2023, when I did rewrite God the Artist. And so at that point, I started reaching out to different publishers. And Morgan McCarver Publishing in New York, they were the one who got back to me and said, it’s a little bit too short. It’s not a no, but we need you to lengthen it. And so I spent about a week and a half doubling the word count, and I sent it back to them as an application. And then, as they say, the rest is history. But of course, I know that whole story sounds super simple, but during that time, that was probably the first time in my life that I completely gave something to God. It’s easy to say, like, I give this to God or whatever, but I like to be in control. And so it’s very hard for me to physically remove myself from that situation and completely give something to God in that way. But with this, I had tried to publish the book years ago. It didn’t go anywhere. And so I just prayed, you know, lord, if you are telling me to do this again, even though it failed the first time, then it’s going to have to be all of you, because I tried this and it didn’t work my way. And I don’t know anything about publishing books. I don’t know anything really about writing books. So if this is really your voice and really you telling me to do this, then you’re going to have to be the one to make things happen and get things published. And so one publisher reaching out and one acceptance, that was just a clear sign from me or for me from God, that that is truly his plan.

00:28:20 – Johnny Sanders
I think that’s, that’s a great story there of that one perseverance, but also just faith, trust and hope in God that, hey, I don’t know why things line up in this way, but they, they do it for a reason. And yeah, I think that’s, that’s great that despite this not really truly being your idea, that it still went through that way. And sometimes God’s plans that he has for us. Sometimes, it’s us working hard, and then eventually happens. And other times it just seems, seems to happen because it happens. We don’t fully always know the reason why. And for those that are listening, maybe, maybe like myself, that are just really not huge into art, maybe they’ve never seen themselves as creative. Kind of like we talked about in the beginning. Why for them, would a book about God the artist, why might that be a good book for somebody that’s really don’t, doesn’t consider themselves artistic? Why might that be a good book for them to read?

00:29:23 – Morgan McCarver
Of course, I’ve heard that at festivals I’ve done, people will walk up to me and tell me that they’re not creative, and I see where they’re coming from, but it really does break my heart because as you mentioned, God is a creator God, and I believe that we are created in his image. And so by default, if God is creative, then we are all creative. And that’s the very first verb in Genesis, the very first book of the Bible, the very first verse. In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth. So we’re introduced to God as a creator God, as an imaginative God. I think some things, including social media, have taken away that joy from us because we view ourselves as not as good as others, and so I’m not as good as this person on social media, therefore I’m not creative. And that’s not biblical, that’s not what God says, and that’s not what I believe is true. I think we’re all creative in our own ways. Creativity, the definition is to make something that didn’t exist before. And so if you think about that, that is such a broad and all-encompassing term that, as you mentioned, making this podcast is definitely a form of creativity. I like to say that bringing organization, organizing a closet, is another form of creativity. You’re bringing something, organization out of nothing, and even Excel spreadsheets. You’re creating something that betters your life and helps your business. There are all these different ways that you can be creative and look different than just your stereotypical painting, singing, and dancing. And I think that’s just so important to remember that God gave us all creativity, but he also gave us all a passion, for our very specific talents of creativity. And so by me being able to focus on my talents and focus on my passion for creativity, God was able to speak to me in that way. He was able to connect with me through what I was connecting with. So through the pottery. And through my relationship with the clay, he was able to constantly bring that back to my relationship with him. So likewise, God can speak to you and what you’re passionate about. And if you just follow those passions that God gave you, it’s going to bring you joy and it’s going to honor God because he gave you those passions.

00:31:44 – Johnny Sanders
I think that’s well said. And something that, again, like I mentioned in the beginning, is part of why I love having the creativity portion here with some of the guests. And some of the topics on here are, it’s so heavily hit in scripture. You cannot get away, from God being the creator and us being made in his image. It is within our DNA. So like Morgan said, whether you are picking up, your paintbrush or whether you’re making that Excel spreadsheet, we have to be creating both in business, in our personal life, and with our families, there are different ways that we can be creating. So I think that’s really well said. Well, Morgan, I think that the listeners here have really gained a lot from your story and just your perspective, on creativity and small business and all sorts of things that we covered today. Where might people find more information about your book and be able to be in contact with you after the show?

00:32:48 – Morgan McCarver
Of course, my website is kind of the headquarters and it’s just my name, www.Morganmccarver.com. From there, you can connect with me on social media, you can sign up for my newsletter, shop my book as well as my pottery, or just message me, and get in contact with me directly through the website. So I’d love to connect with you and hear from you guys. And thank you so much for listening.

00:33:12 – Johnny Sanders
Great. Yeah, I’ll include that website down below. So definitely highly encourage you all to check that out. Look at her artwork, the book, all of that, and being in contact with Morgan. And Morgan, thanks again for coming on and sharing with us today.

00:33:27 – Morgan McCarver
Thank you so much for having me. This has been really great.

00:33:30 – Johnny Sanders
Great. And thank you again to everybody who tuned in for this episode, and I’ll catch you on the next one.